Rarely have I looked at something and said, “This doesn’t work.” Even then on my first edit of my first project it went down from 55,000 to 38,000 before I added several missing scenes. So even an underwriter like myself has to cut and trim before the edit is done.

http://www.sfwa.org/members/rand/solution.html

The.

http://mbarker.livejournal.com/120580.html

A “padding” podcast is actually a great idea, for a number of reasons. You may see that at some point.

Similarly, for the short story market, the editors won’t even blink to reject the story because they don’t have time to help you clean it up.

Here’s the Amazon link: http://www.amazon.com/10%25-Solution-Ken-Rand/dp/0966818407

Amen.

BTW, when Howard talked about knowing he was off track because he had to draw the character’s head at the bottom I realized his four panel form works much like formed poetry–sonnets, haiku, limericks, sestinas. It has a very small, tightly controlled structure that holds only so many words.

Of course, in 20 years this means the next genre to be studied in lit classes will be the four panel comic. Schlock will be anthologized and will probably yield some awful revelation about Howard’s secret agenda with a Marxist reading.

Were there a couple of things that made up the bulk of that fat? I’m interested to hear the types of things you changed in more detail.

That really wasn’t getting me anywhere at all. Over the course of a few years I realized that knowing when to trim is as critical as the act of trimming the work itself.

- Jack

Ahem.

Seems like the general feeling, at least from the agent/edtior blogs I’ve been reading, is that you should have it trimmed and spotless -before- you submit it to an editor.

This episode reminds me of that scene at the beginning of A River Runs Through It where the boy can’t go fishing until he finishes his writing assignment, and every time he turns his writing assignment in to his father, his father says, “Good. Do it again, but half as long.” He does this until the assignment is only about half a page long and then the father finally lets the boy go fishing.
I am rewriting a book right now, and I am pleased to say that some chapters have been shortened, but most of them turn out to be the same length as they were before, and a few are even longer. When this happens, I tell myself that once I have an editor I can worry about trimming. Is this wrong?

Second Draft of my comment:

This podcast reminded me of the first scene in A River Runs Through It where the son has to keep making his writing assignment shorter.
I am rewriting a book right now, and I’m wondering if I should be worried about trimming now, or if I should wait until I get an editor.

Third Draft of my comment:

This podcast reminds me of the writing scene at the beginning of A River Runs Through It.
Should I trim now, or after I get an editor?

Great Podcast!

Each character speaks differently. One remains terse, another tends to ramble, while one might maintain a particular form of speech, like Sazed, throughout Mistborn.

Though a rambling character will always remain on topic, is it a bad idea to incorporate such a character trait, with the fear it’ll require being cut down?

Few things are as important to me as believable characters. Distinct personalities would (IMHO) require some space for establishment and display through the story.

Any suggestions? Many thanks,

Mike

Jana

I should point out, it wasn’t necessarily the teacher’s fault, I’m just lazy.

I’m also an ESL teacher, so if you guys want to fly me out to UT to explain why passive voice doesn’t work in fiction…

In a nutshell, beyond word count issues, the passive voice is used in situations in which the actor or instigator is unknown or unimportant. (For example, if you’re reporting a crime where the perp is unknown, or if you’re reporting the results of a scientific experiment in which the whole point is that the same results could be replicated no matter who performed the tests.) This is NOT the situation in writing where the purpose is to entertain. 99 times out of 100, you want to show a character doing something, which, by definition, is active. There are also stylistic/ flow considerations, but that’s the nitty-gritty.

And there was something else…

My writing style is/was very rambling – oddly, perhaps, this demands absolute iron control, else rambling will deteriorate into mere babbling. I need the exact words exactly in the right place to convey exactly what I want to say – even if that something is nonsense. It is essential. I will trim sentences I’m not happy with endlessly, until I like them – it may well be only a word here or there. When I have succeeded, however, nothing on earth will make me change it again.

But then, I never really expected to have – what I affectionately call – my worst-seller published, even if I actually managed to finish it.

I always used to say that:

a) I would never finish it
b) if I did, it would never be published
c) if it was published, no one would ever read it

Being the cheerful soul I am (no, really!), I hate disappointment, and I flatter myself I’ve covered all contingencies.

So, you can see what I meant – instead of rambling, I’ve descended into babbling, and yet – believe it or not – I have actually trimmed this post (there was one word in particular that I really wanted, which was annoyingly eluding me – but I caught it at last.) One of the reasons I haven’t written anything for some while, is that I am constantly tired, and my judgement has deserted me.

Ah, well… (shrugs shoulders despondently)

I’m doing another edit now, thinking I had already trimmed out all the fat and, surprise, I’m still finding more. Perhaps my manuscript isn’t getting enough exercise.

You can never be entirely objective about your own work, but letting it sit for a while helps bring you closer.

Rarely have I looked at something and said, “This doesn’t work.” Even then on my first edit of my first project it went down from 55,000 to 38,000 before I added several missing scenes. So even an underwriter like myself has to cut and trim before the edit is done.